Is the GameCube a failure?

What do you think? Take this poll!

I've done the poll. I don't think Nintendo are a failure at all.

Not what he asked. The GC isn't a faliure, it just hasn't reached it's potential.

Of course not, it has IMO the best line-up of games, and it is the most powerful console - it crushes the competition. Just because it hasn't sold well in Europe dosn't mean its a failier - and Nintendo are still making money on it.

and it is the most powerful console - it crushes the competition

Na that's wrong. It has the best effects maybe, but it's not the most poweful.

[ Edited by ChrisMGS on 2005/1/18 9:40 ]

IMO, only the recent lack of 3rd party support has let the GC down. I would never have bought an XBox if I could have played PES4, Burnout 3 and a few others. In 2002/3 the GC had Burnout 2 and the Jap WE6-FE (PES 2.5). Infact, just B3 + PES4 would probably have been enough for me. In terms of sales, it has failed relative to the PS2. The XBox may even have beaten it to 3rd place. But in terms of profitability I think the GC is easily in 2nd place, and possibly not too far behind PS2. Still, how much of Ninty's money comes from the success of it's handheld devision?

Na that's wrong. It has the best effects maybe, but it's not the most poweful.

When I got an xbox I was arguing that they were equally as powerful. Now I own an xbox and tried lots of games, including demos of games which are meant to be spectacular, theres no doubt in my mind that GameCube is technically better. I was actually suprised at how much better. The best GameCube games, compared to the best xbox games are significantly faster at loading, they're much smoother with less jaggies, much better textures, richer colours, and above all the GameCube seams to be able to handle far more going on at once, inclulding more AI and effects.

[ Edited by beamrider2600 on 2005/1/18 9:46 ]

No way....in terms of quality no. In terms of sales and profitability it is a step down but still makes lots of $

You obviously haven't played Outrun 2, Rallisport Challenge 2 or burnout 3. These games look amazing. The depth is especially impressive, and the detail on buildings even in the background. Car models etc etc. It's just a shame that I don't have Burnout 2 any more or i could have compared them. Personally if anything, I'd suggest the XBox has the Edge.

Better AI? what are you comparing?

Casual gamers fault to a certain extent, but it is the lack of third party games, ps2 succeeds as its the casual gamers console. Now Ea and ninty are working together its gonna help the cube with some more third party games. And Ea do advertise their games unlike Ninty.

Mmm and what does AI have to do with power of the console? Xbox is the most powerul and can produce the best looking games with the biggest levels. The GameCube can do some very nice effects, like the water in Pikmin and the lighting in Resi, but the levels are smaller.

No one buys a GC for thirst party games though, so why does everyone keep going on about them? To get caual gamers interested and sell more consoles? The reason the GC isn't doing as well as it could is because Nintendo haven't been regularly releasing big first party games.

No one buys a GC for thirst party games though, so why does everyone keep going on about them? To get caual gamers interested and sell more consoles? The reason the GC isn't doing as well as it could is because Nintendo haven't been regularly releasing big first party games.

Ikaruga wrote:
You obviously haven't played Outrun 2, Rallisport Challenge 2 or burnout 3. These games look amazing. The depth is especially impressive, and the detail on buildings even in the background. Car models etc etc. It's just a shame that I don't have Burnout 2 any more or i could have compared them. Personally if anything, I'd suggest the XBox has the Edge.

Better AI? what are you comparing?

Is this graphics wise? Because if it is you obviously have not played RE4, MPE, Rebel Strike, FFCC. I am saying gc is at least xboxes equal in graphics. I have noticed a lot of xbox games have bad framerates as well. But in AI you ARE CERTAINLY RIGHT.

Own the RE4 demo, and MPE. RE4 should arrive this week infact. The thing about RE4, is that they have letterboxed it. This was a trick used during the snes days to keep frame rate up in games like SF2. To be honest, thinking about it. I haven't put the 2 consoles side by side for a fair evaluation. Anyway, whichever way, the difference between the 2 consoles graphically should be far less of a consideration than the games themselves.

On a seperate point, I find it odd that people criticise XBox games for looking too realistic, but then applaud RE4 for it's amazing looking graphics, (which also look realistic).

[ Edited by Ikaruga on 2005/1/18 11:06 ]

I never said they are too realistic....but you talk as if xbox is leagues ahead of gc but it isn't, they are side by side with xbox having a slight edge on the technical side. I urge you to play Rebel Strike. It has the record of having the most polys pushed per second, and it looks really good.

The Best Games on xbox look as good as the best games o gc.

ChrisMGS wrote:
Mmm and what does AI have to do with power of the console? Xbox is the most powerul and can produce the best looking games with the biggest levels. The GameCube can do some very nice effects, like the water in Pikmin and the lighting in Resi, but the levels are smaller.

AI is basically a lot of rules that control how an object acts/reacts.
a simple AI requires less in terms of cpu power, whereas a more complex AI will be more demanding, with several arguments that compare certain bits and peices.

so AI does have something to do with CPU power, at least as much as graphics. and I see the point AI is software... but so are graphics.

Xbox is the most powerul and can produce the best looking games with the biggest levels.

You obviously haven't played Outrun 2, Rallisport Challenge 2 or burnout 3. These games look amazing. The depth is especially impressive, and the detail on buildings even in the background. Car models etc etc. It's just a shame that I don't have Burnout 2 any more or i could have compared them. Personally if anything, I'd suggest the XBox has the Edge.

Better AI? what are you comparing?

Rallisport challange and Burnout 3 do nothing that the GameCube couldn't do - I admit Burnout 3 looks impressive but nothing incredably so. AI, I was mainly thinking of games like Pikmin and Pikmin 2 where each individual Pikmin has its own individual AI, and there are hundreds of them - I actually have my doubts whether something like that could be done on xbox.

For an example, look at games like Starfox Adventures, whether you like the game or not is irrelevent, but either way you must be able to see how good the graphics are. When you get the high-deffinition display, try zooming right in on some of the textures and see how much detail they have. Then go somewhere where you can look down at a big level from a distance - and zoom in on the distance, you can in places see enemies moving around even further away than you could see in normal view - and nothing pops up as you get closer to it - and its all in the same wonderful detail of texture - and there are no jagged lines. Through all of this the framerate remains at a near flawless 60fps. What else? Oh yes, did you notice any loading times? I didn't - it loads almost instantly. I don't see the xbox doing any of that.

In order to make a fairer comparason I should talk about an xbox game that I consider to be among the best looking. The Conker: Live and Reloaded demo. The textures and effects are amazing, and it all runs really smoothly. But then its flawed, its not as colourful as GameCube games are, there are slight traces of jagged lines - and the loading times are longer than desirable - quick by xbox standards, but most GameCube games don't even have loading screens. Admittedly its not a finished game.

Anyway, I promised not to turn this into an argument - but its so tempting to get drawn into this subject because I feel very strongly about it - but I'll stop there.

I never said they are too realistic....but you talk as if xbox is leagues ahead of gc but it isn't, they are side by side with xbox having a slight edge on the technical side. I urge you to play Rebel Strike. It has the record of having the most polys pushed per second, and it looks really good.

Sorry mate if you thought my post wasn't directed at you, it wasn't. Just have read a number of threads on the net in general where people have criticised the XBox games for being too realistic. In some ways I agree with them. However it's realistic settings that bore me, not realistic graphics. I like games to look realistic, but based on fantasy if you know what I mean. Also, I've never said the XBox was 'leagues ahead'. I would say XBox games tend to look better, but not by a huge amount. As I pointed out above, it really doesn't matter all that much. Once you get into a game you're often to engrossed to really appriciate the graphics anyway.

Just because you say something is true dosn't make it so - graphics-wise, xbox games look very poor compared to GameCube games and I've seen far bigger levels on GameCube.

Surely this works both ways? why should we take your word? Especially as you're so pro Nintendo in the first place. You may believe GC games look better than XBox games, (lets assume you are right for the moment), but claiming XBox games look 'very poor in comparison' is nonsense.

Rallisport challange and Burnout 3 do nothing that the GameCube couldn't do - I admit Burnout 3 looks impressive but nothing incredably so. AI, I was mainly thinking of games like Pikmin and Pikmin 2 where each individual Pikmin has its own individual AI, and there are hundreds of them - I actually have my doubts whether something like that could be done on xbox.

Fair enough. Your entitled to your opinion. Just seemed to me that those games offered a higher level of graphics than I had seen on GC. As for Pikmin, how exactly does every Pikmin have it's own AI? there are several types/grades of Pikmin, otherwise they are identical. You control there movements and there actions. It's not as though they control themselves. In Halo, you have several other Soldiers fighting on your side who act independantly and will attack the enemy. The enemy won't just attack, but will retreat only to regroup and attack again. They'll use shields or scenery to protect themselves. This is what I would consider proper AI. When a Pikmin finishes a task it just stands there. I can see absolutely no reason why the XBox couldn't handle Pikmin at all. Especially as the XBox has 64MB of ram and the HDD and the GC only has 24GB main ram, 16GB to keep loading times down, (or so I've been told).

SFA does look great. Was quite an enjoyable game even if it did feature rather mundane/linear gameplay. The main thing that kept me going infact, was to see the next area. Are load times really that important? Of course, shorter load times are preferable, but I'm more interested in how the game actually plays. Load times are generally limited to before a level anyway. Games like MP use the lifts and doors to disguise load times. Clever, but they're still there. The smaller GC discs also have the advantage of quicker access times. Also, with less memory, there's less to transfer from the disc at the beggining. However, you never need to swap discs on the XBox as you do with some GC games. Still, none of the above bothers me really.

[ Edited by Ikaruga on 2005/1/18 14:30 ]

NO WAY!!

GameCube did very well! Even with competition from powerhouse Microsoft!

Yeah, it came 2nd and that i guess is good enough for them. Sony got their console out a year early, they are bound to do better. In terms of power, i think its a great little powerhouse, home to many great 1st party games, shame about 3rd party support though.

NOOOOO!!! GC is the best!! there no denying it! (not even behind my back...)

What the fuck? Hundreds of PIKMIN? Yeah, complex AI required there for sure....... Walk about all together with other little flowers.

As for Pikmin, how exactly does every Pikmin have it's own AI? there are several types/grades of Pikmin, otherwise they are identical. You control there movements and there actions.