Favorite Pokemon

iSuicide said:But not those in the third and fourth generation.

:< I don't get why people don't like 3rd and 4th gen Pokémon. They're easily better and more imaginative (overall) than the originals. I can only assume it's the nostalgia talking. Or that they just haven't even played the new games. One of my friends at uni was saying how the original games were way better, so I asked how much of 3rd/4th gen she'd played. She hadn't played them at all. -_-;

(I'm not ranting at you specifically, iSuicide. Just everyone that doesn't like the later games without giving them a chance).

I once had Pokémon Sapphire, Emerald and Diamond, and played all those games in many hours, so I gave them a chance.
Well, I guess you are right. Maybe it's just because of the nostalgia and memories with the first Pokémon-games, that so many 'hate' the new Pokémons. But really, it feels like Nintendo didn't want to make new Pokémon-games. Especially Diamond felt so 'cold'. Like they didn't put any soul or heart in making this game. They just made these new games because fans would buy them no matter what - And we all did.

In my opinion they should stop making new Pokémon-games after HeartGold and SoulSilver, undtil they realize what a really Pokémon-game is. I hope HeartGold and SoulSilver can lead them in the right direction.

I want to join in the rant.

It\'s ridiculous to claim the old games are better. They have:
- No story (it\'s a JRPG! It\'s supposed to be long!)
- No character (except Blue, pretty much - Gen 2 improves on this)
- Uninspired characters (Surge, Erika and Koga couldn\'t be more stereotypical)
- No running shoes
- Awful box management
- Unbalanced game mechanics
- By far the most Pokémon you get sick of (Zubat, Golbat, Geodude, Onix, Graveler, Oddish, Magikarp, Goldeen, etc)
- Undeletable HMs

Just throwing that in there.

Generally I think 3rd gen is the weakest but it has a few awesome \'mons to even things out a little. Likewise Gen 4 is the strongest but it has FLOATZEL.

I agree with Ikana that most people who don\'t like the 3rd and 4th gen designs probably haven\'t given enough time to the games. Even if you don\'t think the Pokémon themselves are great, the 4th gen games are easily better than 1st/2nd gen.

People seem to use the argument \"Pokémon are meant to look like animals, not Digimon\" - To that I say, what makes you think you know more about Pokémon than the series creator, Satoshi Tajiri, who\'d had the ideas brewing in his head since he was a child?
[/rant]

EDIT @ iSuicide:

The series creator said he felt D/P/Pt was the \"ultimate Pokémon game\", so he can\'t have not wanted to make it. Also have you seen the amazing upgrades made to HG/SS? It makes you feel like Gen 5 will be the biggest step forward the series has had so far. Even if the fans bought them \"no matter what\", a good amount of us feel the new games are 100% superior to the old ones.

Also, D/P/Pt feel cold because they\'re set in a very wintery region...

( Edited 03.09.2009 12:35 by SuperLink )

SuperLink said:
It\'s ridiculous to claim the old games are better. They have:
- No story (it\'s a JRPG! It\'s supposed to be long!)
- No character (except Blue, pretty much - Gen 2 improves on this)
- Uninspired characters (Surge, Erika and Koga couldn\'t be more stereotypical)
- No running shoes
- Awful box management
- Unbalanced game mechanics
- By far the most Pokémon you get sick of (Zubat, Golbat, Geodude, Onix, Graveler, Oddish, Magikarp, Goldeen, etc)
- Undeletable HMs

When you compare the old and new games in that way, then everyone can see, that the new games are much better (but I want you to argue, why you get sick of Zubat. I really love that Pokémon. x) ). But that have nothing to do with the Pokémons. Before they were like living creatures, but they are becoming more and more like machines. They don\'t have any souls anymore - Because Nintendo didn\'t use any soul while they worked on these new Pokémons.

SuperLink said:
[...], what makes you think you know more about Pokémon than the series creator, Satoshi Tajiri, who\'d had the ideas brewing in his head since he was a child?

Well, I just don\'t look at Pokémons with the same eyes as he do. He wants machines, I wants living creatures with soul. I just don\'t agree with him. shake:

SuperLink said:

Also, D/P/Pt feel cold because they\'re set in a very wintery region...

Edit: I admit it. I\'m very nostalgia about Pokémon, and that\'s why I don\'t like the new games at all. That may be the \'problem\'.

( Edited 03.09.2009 12:58 by iSuicide )

Completely disagreed on the machines thing. They look less like creatures, and more like monsters, which is what they have always been. Raticate doesn\'t look like a monster, heck not even Linoone looks like a monster, but Pokémon like Sableye and Luxray look more like monsters.

I do see that the legendaries seem to be more mechanical looking (especially Groudon, Kyogre, Dialga and Palkia), but other than that I can\'t see your point. Things haven\'t changed as much as people say.

If a Pokémon like Porygon was made for 4th gen instead of 1st gen, how do you think people would react to him? They would say he\'s a crap Pokémon most likely, simply because they like all the Pokémon they grew up with, regardless of design.

Oh, and I don\'t necessarily hate Zubat myself. The only Pokémon I hate are Floatzel, Bibarel and Bidoof (in that order). But generally Zubat is among the Pokémon people find most annoying.

So here are some examples of Pokémon that feel organic:

Gardevoir

Yanmega

Altaria

There are hundreds of examples, you just have to be made aware of them to appreciate them. Also it should be noted that Giratina doesn\'t look quite so mechanical in his origin forme, he just generally looks like a satanic creature, which is for all intents and purposes what he is supposed to look like.

I admit it. I\'m very nostalgia about Pokémon, and that\'s why I don\'t like the new games at all. That may be the \'problem\'.

iSuicide said:
Before they were like living creatures, but they are becoming more and more like machines. They don\'t have any souls anymore - Because Nintendo didn\'t use any soul while they worked on these new Pokémons.

Magnemite, Magneton, Voltorb, Electrode and Porygon say \'Hi\'.
And yeah, I agree with SL, Pokémon still look very \'organic\', though less like real animals. But I think there\'s a good balance. We have \'machiney\' Pokémon and animal/monster Pokémon in ALL the generations. And them looking less like real animals makes them more original. Come on, how boring do Pokémon like Tauros look? And we do still get animal-like ones anyway. Like Pachirisu.

I remember people whining about how crap Spiritomb looks when 4th gen was revealed...as if Gastly never existed... -_-;

Also, the Pokémon designs for the generations kind of blur into each other, because Pokémon that were designed but aren\'t included in a generation are often included in the next generation. Spheal was originally designed for 2nd gen, if I remember correctly.

( Edited 03.09.2009 14:05 by Ikana )

Yeah, and Shellos was originally to be a 3rd gen Pokémon, which is why there\'s data for a 3rd Shellos variation (maybe we\'ll see it in HG/SS?)

However, the funny thing is that people would call a Pokémon like Kingdra awesome, and a Pokémon like Walrein awful, even if they were intended for the same gen.

And another point on the animal thing:

- Starly looks more like a bird than HootHoot
- Bidoof looks more like a Beaver than Sentret looks like a Ferret
- Kriketune is incredibly obviously based on a Cricket, which there hasn\'t been a Pokémon of before.
- Combee, Cherubi, Buneary, Stunky, Chatot, Skorupi and more, all based heavily and unmistakably on animals/plants that haven\'t been a Pokémon yet.

( Edited 03.09.2009 14:20 by SuperLink )

The Sinnoh region is the least fun to explore IMO with Hoenn being the best.

I pretty much like all pokemon. It's nice that there is now a huge variety to choose from as it wouldn't be fun catching the same 150 every game. Plus it's great when they add new evolutions to existing pkmn, even if some of them are stupid looking like Togekiss.

They should however, have more side-stories and quests. Kinda like the Unown Ruins in Crystal except expanded upon. I didn't like how there were Unown ruins in Sinnoh just for the sake of it. A little quest to explore more about it would have been better.

Also, random weather. Why have it show or rain constantly in certain locations? Imagine walking down a route and suddenly it starts raining and your like "crap, I only have fire pokemon".

SuperLink said:
- Starly looks more like a bird than HootHoot

I would say that weather in Pokémon games could be synced with your local weather.

The only problem would be that we would hardly get any nice days in Britain!

My favorite version was Green.

My favorite would have to be...(drumroll) lucario!!!

Speaking on terms of the 3rd/4th gen. I really like some of the pokemon in the r/s gen but i never really cared for the 4th gen at all.

(who really cares about a monkey who can fart fire......)

pokemon next to Yu-Gi-Oh this was the most popular card game kid-wise
As of how many are in the world well
around 5,000 which doesn't seem right (Estimated March 3rd 2009)

I've always liked Articuno. Never been a big fan of most after the first 251.

Blastoise
Hitmonlee
Dugtrio
Articuno
Golduck
Sableye
Gengar
Scizor
Kabutops
Victreebel
Lugia

My favourite types are Water and Ice.

As for gens:

1. Silver/Gold
2. Blue/Red
3. Pearl/Diamond
4. Sapphire/Pearl

I haven\'t really followed Pokemon for years, but SL, all those things you listed that were wrong with the first two sets of games will be fixed (or rather, brought \'up to date\'), therefore making G/S easily the best games. Johto was the best region AND you could go back to Kanto, and I also have to agree with the people saying the best Pokemon came from R/B and G/S. Ruby and Sapphire were awful, too much focus on crap features, not enough Pokemon, too small a region and the least replay-value out of them all (bar the original Red and Blue). Diamond and Pearl were better, but more than one region would have been nice. At least you can feasably get all the Pokemon on D/P, as my brother has done. In R/S it was just too much time, effort and hassle.

( Edited 08.09.2009 20:25 by Robsy )

therefore making G/S easily the best games. Johto was the best region AND you could go back to Kanto, and I also have to agree with the people saying the best Pokemon came from R/B and G/S.

too small a region

And like I\'d said earlier in the thread, arguably DPPt is a bigger game than GSC anyway, as generally the play times people give for 4th gen are much longer than 2nd gen.

Still, it\'ll likely be made even longer for the remake.

( Edited 08.09.2009 20:58 by SuperLink )

I'm pretty sure that HeartGold/SoulSilver will be the best Pokémon games so far. Until that's out though, my favourite will easily be Ruby/Sapphire (then D/P/Pt, then G/S/C, then R/B/Y). Ruby and Sapphire was awesome. Good story, Hoenn is great to explore (little bit better than Sinnoh in my opinion, it's close though) and the 3rd gen Pokémon are my favourites.

Robsy said:
Ruby and Sapphire were awful, too much focus on crap features, not enough Pokemon, too small a region and the least replay-value out of them all (bar the original Red and Blue).

Don't agree at all. I clocked more hours in Ruby/Sapphire/Emerald than any other gen (over 700 hours). There's far more to do in it than earlier games. Gold/Silver is pretty small to be honest, especially Kanto, which was practically empty. And 3rd gen is the largest set of Pokémon bar 1st gen.

I wouldn't say R/S was definitely better than G/S...in fact once the game mechanics have been updated and some new features have been added, I'm certain G/S will be better. But R/S is FAR from awful.

RS is also the best manga arc by far.

:< I'll be waiting a looong time to read that. I just read the second volume. I'm glad I waited to get a proper hard copy though.